Lynch's Dune - Reconstructed

[Stoned in Arrakeen]

In an interview with Cinefantastique magazine, David Lynch said of his
'Dune' "There’s something wrong with that movie. I don’t really know
what it is, and I’m not certain you could fix it".

A few years on, in 1988, MCA TV tried to "fix it" by extending the
running time by 40 minutes (from the 137 of the theatrical version to
177 minutes) by the addition of several previously-deleted scenes and a
lengthened introduction. All to no avail, alas, as it was a mess.

I recently downloaded and watched a new "fan-edit" by one 'Spicediver'
from here :

http://fanedit.org/598/

He's attempted to fix it by using material from both sources, above, as
well as some deleted scenes that appeared on the 2005 Universal Region 1
DVD release. The censored parts of the MCA release have been restored
(the Baron spitting on Jessica's face and killing the boy, etc), while
various other scenes have been repositioned and/or removed altogether.
Parts of the dialogue and even the soundtrack have been tweaked as well.
This new version has a runtime of 183 minutes.

This is all really ironic as Spicediver admits "no amount of re-editing
or new scenes would fix such inherent shortcomings (in the film)". He
still did it, though. So what's it like?

It's not bad at all. I'd certainly make it the version I'd watch from
now on, though to be honest I myself think the basic movie is so
fundamentally flawed that it doesn't bear repeated viewing. Video
quality, and sound is excellent.

I got the 1.95 Gb avi version hosted on the Demonoid BitTorrent tracker :

http://www.demonoid.com/files/details/1546835/

(I don't know whether those who aren't Demonoid members will be able to
"see" that link, let alone download from it). Alternatively, the page
gives links to the same file on RapidShare (a service I don't like, and
try to avoid whenever possible). There's also a 2-DVD version available,
through RapidShare.

There are two more fan-edits available :

http://fanedit.org/355/
http://fanedit.org/350/

........ But I haven't seen these.

There you have it.

[Raveem]

The original film contains numerous obvious problems (weirding
modules, rain at the end, etc.), one particularly jarring
incompatibility just shattered the suspension of disbelief for me
beyond repair. That was the character of the Baron. In Dune, the baron
was ruthless, cruel, scheming and fat. But not stupid. Definitely not
stupid. The Baron in the film is some kind of mad disgusting bumbling
buffoon. I'd strongly agree that the film is fundamentally flawed.

Raveem.

[Wild Monkshood]

Post by Raveem
The original film contains numerous obvious problems (weirding
modules, rain at the end, etc.), one particularly jarring
incompatibility just shattered the suspension of disbelief for me
beyond repair. That was the character of the Baron. In Dune, the baron
was ruthless, cruel, scheming and fat. But not stupid. Definitely not
stupid. The Baron in the film is some kind of mad disgusting bumbling
buffoon. I'd strongly agree that the film is fundamentally flawed.
Raveem.

I will admit a certain fondness for Lynch's Dune, flaws and all. I
see it as an interesting interpretation of FH's Novel. I also admit that
to someone who wasn't already well grounded in the novel, it would
appear to be what is known as a "hot mess". And this post has made me
decide to brave the closet and try to find my soundtrack CD.

WM

[Stoned in Arrakeen]

Post by Wild Monkshood

Post by Raveem
The original film contains numerous obvious problems (weirding
modules, rain at the end, etc.), one particularly jarring
incompatibility just shattered the suspension of disbelief for me
beyond repair. That was the character of the Baron. In Dune, the baron
was ruthless, cruel, scheming and fat. But not stupid. Definitely not
stupid. The Baron in the film is some kind of mad disgusting bumbling
buffoon. I'd strongly agree that the film is fundamentally flawed.

I will admit a certain fondness for Lynch's Dune, flaws and all. I
see it as an interesting interpretation of FH's Novel. I also admit that
to someone who wasn't already well grounded in the novel, it would
appear to be what is known as a "hot mess". And this post has made me
decide to brave the closet and try to find my soundtrack CD.

{Whisper} ............ I, ah, think the soundtrack's slightly overrated.
To be honest ......... it's awful, though I like the Eno contribution.

The shadow of the Bladerunner soundtrack covers all, eh?

[Stoned in Arrakeen]

Post by Raveem
The original film contains numerous obvious problems (weirding
modules, rain at the end, etc.), one particularly jarring
incompatibility just shattered the suspension of disbelief for me
beyond repair. That was the character of the Baron. In Dune, the baron
was ruthless, cruel, scheming and fat. But not stupid. Definitely not
stupid. The Baron in the film is some kind of mad disgusting bumbling
buffoon. I'd strongly agree that the film is fundamentally flawed.

You betcha. My opinion is that future editors of the movie, whether fans
or studio professionals, should be thinking of severely shortening it,
though I understand how tempting it must be to make any "new" version
longer than the last one.

Yes; the movie Baron was awful. A mere caricature of the real thing. The
performance would be a severe obstacle to making a decent edit, as the
role is so central to the story. "He'll know .......... HE'LL KNOW!,
that it was I, Baron VLADIMIR HARKONNEN!, who ............" Oh, shut up,
you overacting shit!

Paul is too bland. Jessica is reduced to a whimpering zero. Stilgar -
Ugh! - has an apparent speech impediment-aah. Thufir Hawat constantly
looks like he's had one too many. Sting should have stuck to singing.
Gaius Helen Mohiam overacted outrageously. Alia was ........ creepy. To
me, the most disturbing, and disappointing thing about the movie is that
I often find myself laughing at all those things, and more. Kind of
breaks the mood.

And the weirding modules. That whole plotline, and everything that goes
with it, would have to go. If Brian & Kevin could have interpreted Dune
for the movies, it would be like this. Jesus.

Hell ......... it's only a movie.

[Timewalker]

Post by Stoned in Arrakeen
Paul is too bland. Jessica is reduced to a whimpering zero. Stilgar -
Ugh! - has an apparent speech impediment-aah. Thufir Hawat constantly
looks like he's had one too many. Sting should have stuck to singing.
Gaius Helen Mohiam overacted outrageously. Alia was ........ creepy. To
me, the most disturbing, and disappointing thing about the movie is that
I often find myself laughing at all those things, and more. Kind of
breaks the mood.

I must disagree on these points (well, not about Paul; Kyle
MacLaughlin has shown himself to be better at comedy acting than
dramatic acting). I enjoyed Everett McGill's portrayal of Stilgar --
and found his speech to be superior to most of the actors, who were
mostly incapable of pronouncing "Muad'Dib." McGill had that exactly
right. I suspect it is the coughing sounds he made in his first scenes
that irritated you? They bothered me as well, but I have almost
managed to convince myself that those sounds were intended as a sort
of coded communication to the other Fremen (much like the continual
"hmm" and "aah" affectations of Count Fenring).

Sian Phillips was exactly right as Mohiam. Please don't let her
ridiculous costume and makeup get in the way of appreciating her basic
portrayal as a tough-minded Bene Gesserit Reverend Mother.

Yes, Alia was creepy. She was *supposed* to be creepy. Even in the
canon material, Frank's characters considered her (and all Pre-Born)
to be creepy.

The part that consistently made me laugh? The part right after Paul
kills Feyd. Stilgar's shocked "Muad'Dib!" at seeing what happens to
Feyd's body... makes me think that his next words should be, "The
floor -- my god, you broke the floor!"

[Raveem]

"And the weirding modules. That whole plotline, and everything that
goes
with it, would have to go. If Brian & Kevin could have interpreted
Dune
for the movies, it would be like this. Jesus. "


It's funny you should say that. Apparently, BH *likes* the film!


"Although the Kenneth MacMillian portrayal is often criticized by
fans,
Frank's son Brian Herbert wrote in his Biography of his father that he
very much approved of Lynch's portrayal of the book including the
changes he made such as the Weirding Module."


If anything further was needed to eternally emboss the stamp of
avoidance on the Lynch film...

Raveem.

[Raveem]

And the uncyclopedia entry on KJA (http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/
Kevin_J._Anderson),:

"Kevin J. Anderson didn't write the script for the Dune movie, but
you'd be forgiven for having thought so."

That entry has some nice hate venting stuff on it:

"“Fucking ... fuck. I read that fucking Cock-Gobbling Hack Writer
Whores of Dune novelisation. I want to hurt Kevin J. Anderson. In the
face.”

~ Everyone"

Raveem.

[Stoned in Arrakeen]

Post by Raveem
And the uncyclopedia entry on KJA (http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/

A non-wrapped version :
http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Kevin_J._Anderson

Post by Raveem
"Kevin J. Anderson didn't write the script for the Dune movie, but
you'd be forgiven for having thought so."

Yep. That was the best film treatment that Kev never wrote. No doubt
about it.

Post by Raveem
“Fucking ... fuck. I read that fucking Cock-Gobbling Hack Writer
Whores of Dune novelisation. I want to hurt Kevin J. Anderson. In the
face.”

Meh! I like the first two words. The level of emotional intensity is
almost overwhelming.

[Stoned in Arrakeen]

Post by Raveem
"Although the Kenneth MacMillian portrayal is often criticized by
fans, Frank's son Brian Herbert wrote in his Biography of his father that he
very much approved of Lynch's portrayal of the book including the
changes he made such as the Weirding Module."
If anything further was needed to eternally emboss the stamp of
avoidance on the Lynch film...

Unfortunately, it's worse than you imagine. It's actually Frank who is
doing the "approving" in the quote, above. He was quite vocal about his
support for the film right up to his death. Very disappointing.

[Raveem]

Yeah, I'd read of FH's own approval of the steaming film and hadn't
realised this was what was being mentioned here. Oops. But as the
creator of Dune, it's his right to do that. Maybe there was some
lesson about how a lot of good ideas can morph into something
unrecognisable when translated out of its native medium? Grasping at
straws... As it is, I think it's probably forgivable to think that it
was BH doing the approving :). It's so in character the mind leaps to
that conclusion!

Raveem.

[Stoned in Arrakeen]

Post by Raveem
Yeah, I'd read of FH's own approval of the steaming film and hadn't
realised this was what was being mentioned here. Oops. But as the
creator of Dune, it's his right to do that. Maybe there was some
lesson about how a lot of good ideas can morph into something
unrecognisable when translated out of its native medium? Grasping at
straws... As it is, I think it's probably forgivable to think that it
was BH doing the approving :). It's so in character the mind leaps to
that conclusion!

Easy mistake to make - the quoted text wasn't very clear. The
disappointment I talked about is directed at Frank for supporting such a
silly film.

[Freakzilla]

Raveem said on 14/08/2008 14:45:> Yeah, I'd read of FH's own approval of the steaming film and hadn't

Post by Raveem
realised this was what was being mentioned here. Oops. But as the
creator of Dune, it's his right to do that. Maybe there was some
lesson about how a lot of good ideas can morph into something
unrecognisable when translated out of its native medium? Grasping at
straws... As it is, I think it's probably forgivable to think that it
was BH doing the approving :). It's so in character the mind leaps to
that conclusion!

Easy mistake to make - the quoted text wasn't very clear. The
disappointment I talked about is directed at Frank for supporting such a
silly film.

Frank had to support the film or it wouldn't have done well.

Read the introduction to Eye to see his scathing indictment of the
entire film industry as well as the Mexican government.

[Stoned in Arrakeen]

Post by Freakzilla

Raveem said on 14/08/2008 14:45:> Yeah, I'd read of FH's own approval of the steaming film and hadn't

Post by Raveem
realised this was what was being mentioned here. Oops. But as the
creator of Dune, it's his right to do that. Maybe there was some
lesson about how a lot of good ideas can morph into something
unrecognisable when translated out of its native medium? Grasping at
straws... As it is, I think it's probably forgivable to think that it
was BH doing the approving :). It's so in character the mind leaps to
that conclusion!

Easy mistake to make - the quoted text wasn't very clear. The
disappointment I talked about is directed at Frank for supporting such a
silly film.

Frank had to support the film or it wouldn't have done well.

I understand the pressures he must have been under at the time. Such a
shame. I can't help thinking, though, that if he'd been brave and
roundly condemned it the publicity would have helped the film do better
in the marketplace.

Post by Freakzilla
Read the introduction to Eye to see his scathing indictment of the
entire film industry as well as the Mexican government.

I read it. It's better, I think, to read in the indictments as some sort
of coded comment on the film.

[Freakzilla]

Post by Stoned in Arrakeen

Post by Freakzilla

Raveem said on 14/08/2008 14:45:> Yeah, I'd read of FH's own approval of the steaming film and hadn't

Post by Raveem
realised this was what was being mentioned here. Oops. But as the
creator of Dune, it's his right to do that. Maybe there was some
lesson about how a lot of good ideas can morph into something
unrecognisable when translated out of its native medium? Grasping at
straws... As it is, I think it's probably forgivable to think that it
was BH doing the approving :). It's so in character the mind leaps to
that conclusion!

Easy mistake to make - the quoted text wasn't very clear. The
disappointment I talked about is directed at Frank for supporting such a
silly film.

Frank had to support the film or it wouldn't have done well.

I understand the pressures he must have been under at the time. Such a
shame. I can't help thinking, though, that if he'd been brave and
roundly condemned it the publicity would have helped the film do better
in the marketplace.

Post by Freakzilla
Read the introduction to Eye to see his scathing indictment of the
entire film industry as well as the Mexican government.

I read it. It's better, I think, to read in the indictments as some sort
of coded comment on the film.

Exactly. I think that was his way of venting.

[Stoned in Arrakeen]

Post by Timewalker

Post by Stoned in Arrakeen
Paul is too bland. Jessica is reduced to a whimpering zero. Stilgar -
Ugh! - has an apparent speech impediment-aah. Thufir Hawat constantly
looks like he's had one too many. Sting should have stuck to singing.
Gaius Helen Mohiam overacted outrageously. Alia was ........ creepy. To
me, the most disturbing, and disappointing thing about the movie is that
I often find myself laughing at all those things, and more. Kind of
breaks the mood.

I must disagree on these points (well, not about Paul; Kyle
MacLaughlin has shown himself to be better at comedy acting than
dramatic acting). I enjoyed Everett McGill's portrayal of Stilgar --
and found his speech to be superior to most of the actors, who were
mostly incapable of pronouncing "Muad'Dib." McGill had that exactly right.

Well ............ not quite. Ugh! "Muwaaahd Deeebaaaaahh" just sounds
silly, and every time he does it I want to bash his face in. Ugh! But
then I think about how good he was in 'Twin Peaks' and 'The People Under
the Stairs' and I forgive him. Ugh!

Post by Timewalker
I suspect it is the coughing sounds he made in his first scenes that irritated you?

No; can't say I noticed them at all. Ugh!

Post by Timewalker
They bothered me as well, but I have almost
managed to convince myself that those sounds were intended as a sort
of coded communication to the other Fremen (much like the continual
"hmm" and "aah" affectations of Count Fenring).

Your theory is valid. Ugh! However, if I were a Fremen and I received a
coded communication like that from him I'd seperate him from his water
so fast it'd make his head spin, the throat-clearing shit. I realise,
mind, it's nothing to get upset over. Ugh!

Post by Timewalker
Sian Phillips was exactly right as Mohiam. Please don't let her
ridiculous costume and makeup get in the way of appreciating her basic
portrayal as a tough-minded Bene Gesserit Reverend Mother.

I'm OK with her portrayal right up to the
"Get-out-of-my-miiiiiiiiinnnndddd" bit. Thereafter, she'd join Mr.
Speech Impedimentaahh, above, in the deathstill, after a good beating
with the corpse of Alia.

Post by Timewalker
Yes, Alia was creepy. She was *supposed* to be creepy. Even in the
canon material, Frank's characters considered her (and all Pre-Born)
to be creepy.

Sure - I understand that. But there's creepy, and there's creepy. That
little shit's got the Evil Eye. She must die.

Post by Timewalker
The part that consistently made me laugh? The part right after Paul
kills Feyd. Stilgar's shocked "Muad'Dib!" at seeing what happens to
Feyd's body... makes me think that his next words should be, "The
floor -- my god, you broke the floor!"

Personally I always liked the bit where the Baron sticks his fingers in
Rabban's mouth while he's chewing on that animal-part. Comedy gold.

(Note : Hope this message doesn't double-post. First one didn't go
through, apparently)

[Giovanni Wassen]

Post by Timewalker
(well, not about Paul; Kyle
MacLaughlin has shown himself to be better at comedy acting than
dramatic acting).

Damn fine coffee. I rather liked the actor in Twin Peaks, which isn't
comedy... Well, not really :)