Mapes

[Tony]

In Dune:

"Before I do your bidding, manling," Mapes said, "I must cleanse the way

between us. You've put a water burden on me that I'm not sure I care to support.

But we Fremen pay our debts--be they black debts or white debts. And it's known

to us that you've a traitor in your midst. Who it is, we cannot say, but we're

certain sure of it. Mayhap there's the hand guided that flesh-cutter."



How would Mapes be certain there was a traitor in the Atreides household?

[Sammy Sands]

Post by Tony
"Before I do your bidding, manling," Mapes said, "I must cleanse the way
between us. You've put a water burden on me that I'm not sure I care to support.
But we Fremen pay our debts--be they black debts or white debts. And it's known
to us that you've a traitor in your midst. Who it is, we cannot say, but we're
certain sure of it. Mayhap there's the hand guided that flesh-cutter."
How would Mapes be certain there was a traitor in the Atreides household?

As I've said before, the circumstances of the Shadout Mapes and where
her allegiances would lay was never fully explored or explained.
Obviously, she was a very trusted, tested agent. Either by the Fremen or
the Smugglers, likely both. Just as obviously, she was receiving
intelligence reports that were accurate if not totally encompassing...

Sammy

[Tony]

"Sammy Sands" <***@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:

<snip>

As I've said before, the circumstances of the Shadout Mapes and where her
allegiances would lay was never fully explored or explained. Obviously, she
was a very trusted, tested agent. Either by the Fremen or the Smugglers,
likely both. Just as obviously, she was receiving intelligence reports that
were accurate if not totally encompassing...

I hadn't considered the possible association with the smugglers, but are you
suggesting that the smugglers knew Yueh was a traitor?

[Sammy Sands]

Post by Tony
<snip>

Post by Sammy Sands
As I've said before, the circumstances of the Shadout Mapes and where
her allegiances would lay was never fully explored or explained.
Obviously, she was a very trusted, tested agent. Either by the Fremen
or the Smugglers, likely both. Just as obviously, she was receiving
intelligence reports that were accurate if not totally encompassing...

I hadn't considered the possible association with the smugglers, but are
you suggesting that the smugglers knew Yueh was a traitor?

No.

Sammy

[Tony]

Post by Tony
<snip>

Post by Sammy Sands
As I've said before, the circumstances of the Shadout Mapes and where
her allegiances would lay was never fully explored or explained.
Obviously, she was a very trusted, tested agent. Either by the Fremen
or the Smugglers, likely both. Just as obviously, she was receiving
intelligence reports that were accurate if not totally encompassing...

I hadn't considered the possible association with the smugglers, but are
you suggesting that the smugglers knew Yueh was a traitor?

No.
Sammy

What about that guy hiding in the wall?

[Sammy Sands]

Post by Tony

Post by Tony
<snip>

Post by Sammy Sands
As I've said before, the circumstances of the Shadout Mapes and
where her allegiances would lay was never fully explored or
explained. Obviously, she was a very trusted, tested agent. Either
by the Fremen or the Smugglers, likely both. Just as obviously, she
was receiving intelligence reports that were accurate if not totally
encompassing...

I hadn't considered the possible association with the smugglers, but
are you suggesting that the smugglers knew Yueh was a traitor?

No.
Sammy

What about that guy hiding in the wall?

He was a Hark lackey. No connection to the smugglers that I can recall.
If Mapes sources were smugglers, they didn't know who the traitor was...

Sammy

[Tony]

Post by Tony

Post by Tony
<snip>

As I've said before, the circumstances of the Shadout Mapes and where her
allegiances would lay was never fully explored or explained. Obviously,
she was a very trusted, tested agent. Either by the Fremen or the
Smugglers, likely both. Just as obviously, she was receiving intelligence
reports that were accurate if not totally encompassing...

I hadn't considered the possible association with the smugglers, but are
you suggesting that the smugglers knew Yueh was a traitor?

No.
Sammy

What about that guy hiding in the wall?

He was a Hark lackey. No connection to the smugglers that I can recall. If
Mapes sources were smugglers, they didn't know who the traitor was...
Sammy

It's possible that Mapes heard there was someone in the house who would attack
the family. However, this information may have pertained to the Harkonnen
lackey in the wall, rather than Yueh. I'm not sure how Mapes would have learned
about Yueh because that plot was hatched off planet, unless she knew someone
with prescience who told her about it.

[Sammy Sands]

Post by Tony

Post by Sammy Sands

Post by Tony

Post by Tony
<snip>

Post by Sammy Sands
As I've said before, the circumstances of the Shadout Mapes and
where her allegiances would lay was never fully explored or
explained. Obviously, she was a very trusted, tested agent. Either
by the Fremen or the Smugglers, likely both. Just as obviously,
she was receiving intelligence reports that were accurate if not
totally encompassing...

I hadn't considered the possible association with the smugglers,
but are you suggesting that the smugglers knew Yueh was a traitor?

No.
Sammy

What about that guy hiding in the wall?

He was a Hark lackey. No connection to the smugglers that I can
recall. If Mapes sources were smugglers, they didn't know who the
traitor was...
Sammy

It's possible that Mapes heard there was someone in the house who would
attack the family. However, this information may have pertained to the
Harkonnen lackey in the wall, rather than Yueh. I'm not sure how Mapes
would have learned about Yueh because that plot was hatched off planet,
unless she knew someone with prescience who told her about it.

A hark in the wall would not = a traitor....

Sammy

[Tony]

Post by Sammy Sands

Post by Tony

Post by Tony

Post by Tony
<snip>

Post by Sammy Sands
As I've said before, the circumstances of the Shadout Mapes and where
her allegiances would lay was never fully explored or explained.
Obviously, she was a very trusted, tested agent. Either by the Fremen or
the Smugglers, likely both. Just as obviously, she was receiving
intelligence reports that were accurate if not totally encompassing...

I hadn't considered the possible association with the smugglers, but are
you suggesting that the smugglers knew Yueh was a traitor?

No.
Sammy

What about that guy hiding in the wall?

He was a Hark lackey. No connection to the smugglers that I can recall. If
Mapes sources were smugglers, they didn't know who the traitor was...
Sammy

It's possible that Mapes heard there was someone in the house who would
attack the family. However, this information may have pertained to the
Harkonnen lackey in the wall, rather than Yueh. I'm not sure how Mapes would
have learned about Yueh because that plot was hatched off planet, unless she
knew someone with prescience who told her about it.

A hark in the wall would not = a traitor....
Sammy

I agree, but in the "fog or war" things can get confused and misinterpreted.
Perhaps Mapes was "certain" that there was "someone on the inside," and she
interpreted this, quite understandably, as a traitor in the house, "someone
close to you."

[s***@mac.com]

If everything went according to plan, the Harkonnen pull out was going
to be temporary alone, until the Atreides were destroyed. Maybe
someone privy to the plan let it slip and the information eventually
made its way into Fremen hands.

[Stoned in Arrakeen]

the Harkonnen pull out was going to be temporary alone

My head hurts.

[Stoned in Arrakeen]

Post by Tony
I agree, but in the "fog or war" things can get confused and misinterpreted.

That they can, Tones. That they can. Same with the "fog or newsgroups"
as well, eh?!